musky wrote:
I agree.
I see it as having been done for centuries and religion played a key part in control.
Today it is the media.

We might see a few priests and doctors etc identified as being child abusers but unfortunately there are a lot of other cases of the same being done by poor people too. They are not newsworthy though.

In the middle east they still abuse kids and its acceptable there, just as its acceptable to decapitate people in the public square or cut their hands off. Its all about blind obedience of authority.

Nowadays if you can't scare people into obedience then you buy their obedience.

At the end of the day I see the whole shebang as simply about maintaining the paradigm of the wealthy elite remaining wealthy and elite.
Its just about keeping them in their societal positions and allowing them to retain a control over the direction and general agenda.

Lets face it, if we abandoned the monetary system we would have been expanding outside of the solar system by now and colonising other worlds because we have the resources to do so. Instead we waste away, we don't strive to do anything adventurous or important anymore.
We sit on our asses, watch tv, eat junk food goto work and repeat. Where is the drive?

andyh wrote:
What makes me think child abuse in endemic among the establishment is reading the Jimmy Savile thread over the last year and a half, it's all there. Perverts are nurtured and promoted by the establishment (the royal families, the banking familes, the Church, big corporations, the people who run the intelligence agencies) because they are easily controlled if they ever feel like stepping out of line. Hence the high proportion of politicians, lords, celebrities etc who are involved or tainted, compared with the rest of the population.

musky wrote:
No.
I'm claiming that affluence would reduce child abuse solely for those in the lower class bracket.
Its worth noting that being unable to afford decent housing, clothing, education, food etc is in itself a form of child abuse..its worth bearing that in mind and its worth bearing in mind that austerity is reinforcing this with every passing minute and this is in so called wealthy western nations not just parts of Africa.
There are many ways of absuing people than just sexually. One of the biggest forms of abuse we have today is the lack of education, in particular high level university 'liberal' education which is the only form that allows people to be capable of critical thinking, without that they are vulnerable to all sorts of manipulation. The elite were very much against educating to that level in the past, it was reserved solely for the upper classes. Kids should not have to work to pay for it, nor should parents. It should be the duty of society to enable all people to reach their full potential but the economic paradigm works to restrict them, to hold them back.

musky wrote:
All we have seen so far is a few score rich people or people in positions of power who get prosecuted.
Not hundreds, not thousands. Therefore you cannot say its 'endemic' within just that societal bracket because there's thousands of them, millions actually if we want to include certain middle classes like priests.

What we are seeing is merely the law mechanism allowing itself to turn on people working on govt and media whereas in the past such people were untouchable.
This is a good thing but its hardly real progress. It only began for example the moment Saville was dead, then and only then did it kick off.
So we're a long way off yet and what its really about is cronyism isn't it? Corruption. Who watches the watchers.
The whole point of authority is that it is correct and everyone else is wrong, again this is a bit like the abusive parent-child relationship.
Do as I say, not what I do.

musky wrote:

I'm sorry but that's just not true and it would seem that you've had your view rather blinkered from the savile thread if that's what conclusion you've arrived at.

It is as rife throughout the general population as it is in upper class society.

feather wrote:

That actually makes a lot of sense.

psketti wrote:
Its the indignity of it all I suppose.
The 'nobility' are supposed to be 'noble'

There are ofc thousands of cases of abuse by the lower classes but they're not important enough to be covered by the media...in fact the media cannot cover these cases because they go through secret courts so....

Can we stick to if we need a sub-forum or not please? We're bad enough at the best of times reaching conclusions!

And feather has just knocked my thinking on the issue off kilter so I'll be back with an opinion when I know what it is!

The excitement of the first couple of months of that Savile thread, when there were 50 or so posts per minute and people were staying up all night, gripped to the screen, and the amount of new people who reeled onto the thread shaken to the core at the way their world paradigm had exploded by reading it, showed to me that the info gathered on there is like a 'wake up bomb' for newcomers to 'conspiracy' matters, presumably many of those posters who were initially 'woken up' by the Savile info have now moved into researching banking, finance etc as well as other things. Savile etc is a great place for 'newbies' to start, because it is so compelling, and because it branches out into so many 'conspiracy' connections.

oioioi wrote:

Aye, hasn't he just!!


*goes off muttering summit about feather and fuckers*

I just don't talk about this subject because I can't do anything about it. I also see it as a natural consequence of a decadent and corrupt culture. I do not like to see accusations being thrown around liberally on this matter, and I think the accusations that TPV has been unwilling to cover this issue (which I can neither confirm or deny because I haven't seen any of its content), or some even worse implications that have been made, are completely unfair. I'm completely in favour of constructive criticism, but let's keep it constructive.

musky wrote: This is one of the things that genuinely disturbs me with this subject.
It's not an exciting entertainment. It's a slow hell for those subjected to it and they deserve due and proper diligence to put a stop to it for them.

It was compelling because its the first time the established law system addressed the crime of those in key higher societal positions, whereas in the past it turned a blind eye.
It still has yet to address the much much higher level crime of the worlds true elite who have 37 trillion dollars in untaxed bank accounts in the cayman islands. One could even posit that this is deliberate...the middle level cronies are sacrificed to get people focused on the likes of savile instead. Again a lesser importance issue focus and some curing of symptoms but not the disease. Standard divide and conquer tactics 101.

My vote would be for the following...

A sub forum called - CSA discussion and research

This sub forum should be members only - the header will be visible but in order to view it you must be logged in. This goes some way to protecting the forum and also (I would hope) to ensure people don't just read along but instead sign up and participate

The sub forum should have dedicated moderators/facilitators tasked with ensuring the forums protection from libel which is a 'non negotiable' form of facilitation - all other issues can be dealt with in the way the rest of the board is i.e through community feedback and discussion

I personally do not wish to see any subjects 'disallowed' for discussion here and believe that we can accommodate those who have a passion for addressing one issue in the main - we all have ideas as to what needs to be focused on whether that be financial, self sufficiency, child abuse, the 'elite' or other such things.

I also believe that people will post elsewhere on things they find interesting which will add to the already interesting and fun discussions we have around here.

We also have the option of not participating in any new sub forum for those who don't wish to.

Forums evolve over time and with each 'dif cull' we will find that people come here, often with friendships and specific interests - we have to ask ourselves do we adapt or do we ask those arriving here to adapt or should there be a bit of give and take?

My vote would be for the last one.

Most social organisations started in someones kitchen or the back room of a church/community centre.
As they grew and defined their goals those kitchens and back rooms became inadequate for their purpose.
So they move on to an empty shopfront or portacabin and eventually built somewhere designed for their needs.

I'm suggesting DIF was your kitchen/back room.
It's time to decide whether your group is serious enough to go to the next level.

This is a very positive opportunity/crossroads.

feather wrote:
But it's that excitement that led to a hell of a lot of people coming across these subjects for the first time and beginning their 'waking' process. No-one can deny the internet storm that followed the first Savile 'revelations' in the msm. Nothing about banking ever generated such activity and curiosity, it's just a sad fact. I'm in no way implying that it's just an entertainment. But the compelling nature of finding out some of your most cherished artists etc are dodgy leads people to more research and they discover the extent and horror of the suffering.

I am at a loss to understand how a members only sub-forum in any way protects the forum?
What is that statement based upon?

Particularly on a site which does not pre-screen members.

musky wrote:
Unfortunately economic horrors are ignored because to address it you would have to address what motivates the self.
Most people are incapable of that much introspective unemotionally detached cold analysis so they just blink when they see it and carry on focusing on less important issues that are merely symptomatic. The programming we have undergone is literally that complete and effective, its quite depressing to watch and just serves to convince me that nothing will ever truly change on a grand systemic scale.
We might see some small changes here and there but the paradigm will remain forever, ultimately it might actually result in the complete extinction of the human race as we will run out of resources and poison our own environment and bodies beyond repair.

feather wrote:
Only in the sense that it would please the newcomers.
It still would not stop people being careless and leading to a lawsuit etc.
We don't want to come over all authoritarian though lol

musky wrote:

But how much of that does one person really need to absorb?

And by that I mean... if I came across a disturbing body of a corpse, is the disturbing image I'm left with enough to convince me of what I saw, or should I stand and watch the corpse slowly rot just to be absolutely sure?

This kind of knowledge is neither exciting nor entertaining on ANY level and it beggars belief it could be described as such. Although, it's best we get this out in the open now as I can categorically state, that treating it as such around here is going to cause problems!